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05/24/2004: "Security fence doing the job"
In reply to those who think Israel's security fence has nothing to do with security, but is simply part of a land grab, check this out from blogger Josh Harvey, an international relations grad student in Jerusalem:
The IDF is not an unbiased source, but it would no doubt call for abandoning the fence if it wasn't doing the job (especially since it's costing $2 billion that could be spent on military hardware and personnel if it wasn't worth the effort). While attempted terrorist attacks are up, successful ones are down, and that's what counts. I'd still be happier if it were on the Green Line, but if it saves lives (both Israeli and Palestinian–consider how many retaliatory Israeli attacks haven't happened because the fence prevented bombings from killing Israeli civilians), great.
Replies: 6 Comments
on Tuesday, May 25th, Little Fly said
I don't think the fence has nothing to do with security. I don't think it has anything to do with reducing ethnic and religious tension, making the Middle East more stable, cultivating free and open societies, contributing to democracy, contributing to capitalism...
My question remains. If the Palestinians adopted nonviolent resistance tomorrow, would the fence come down?
on Tuesday, May 25th, Athanasius said
Sure--if Israel knew that the Palestinians wouldn't resort to violence again. As far as it goes, if such a guarantee were forthcoming, and backed up with action (start with disarming Arafat's private armies), a Palestinian state could be declared with Israel's blessing. But Israel has been the victim of Arab violence throughout its entire history. Why should such theoretical possibilities even be entertained?
on Tuesday, May 25th, Little Fly said
Because they are what we should want and what we should be striving for, regardless of whether or not achieving them is difficult or painful or costly. Walls are a sign of defeat, not victory. They are a sign that we are not willing to pay the price of free and open societies. If we do not dare to dream of something better, something better will never come. Instead, we build walls, defend ourselves by calling ourselves "realists," and all along the divide between us and them grows wider and wider. It won't be long until our pretty wall starts to show cracks.
on Tuesday, May 25th, Athanasius said
It's easy to be an idealist when people aren't dying for the sake of that idealism. Israel remains a free and open society, albeit one that does not have an open border, which is to say an open door to those who want to kill its citizens.
You're right that the fence is a sign of defeat. It's a sign of defeat for those who hoped that self-interest might prevail among Palestinian leadership. Instead, centuries-old hatred of the Jews, combined with the belief that any land that has ever been part of the Dar al-Islam must remain such eternally, has forced Israel to protect itself by keeping out those who want it dead.
on Tuesday, May 25th, Little Fly said
I don't disagree with you, but the wall is also a sign of defeat for Israeli and international political intelligence that has no hope of reducing the conflict, only reducing casualties. The wall only serves to perpetuate regional conflicts that will not only continue to spill into Israel but will spill into into Afghanistan, into Iraq, into Spain, into the United States, into the Phillipines...
on Saturday, May 29th, Chuck said
It seems that a great deal of spillage is happening in Iraq. Most attackers have been pouring through the Swiss cheese borders in Iraq to cause trouble and give the false impression that Iraqi's are dissatisfied with the U. S. It was reported that the majority of the attacks in Iraq are for hire. The large majority (80-90%) have been paid for by terrorists and foreign supporters of the terrorists since the end of major fighting. However, the going rate for an attack on an American Serviceman has risen from $50 to over $1500 since the majority of attackers have been captured or killed. Sometimes, inflation is a good thing.
Until the supply of radicals is smaller, Israel is probably doing the only thing they can to control the terrorist problem. If the terrorists can't go the Israel, maybe they will attack in Iraq and see how they like the immediate response they will receive.
